Feel the music.

[Jim D]

That's a phrase I've heard now and then over the last few years.
Confession ... I didn't get that they literally meant FEEL.

A buddy of mine, bass player, told me he gets that phrase. Said when he
goes to a concert, he always wears ear plugs and wants to physically "
feel " the music, to have the music loud enough that it vibrates his
body.

There was a thread on talkbass.com ( or maybe it's .org ) this last
week about " are bass amps obsolete ? " I read 27 pages of the
discussion. It broke down to .... on the pro / concert / big club
level, it's all IEM's and direct into the FOH, basically a " silent
stage ". On the low end, it's amps, the bigger the better. The
performers want to " feel " the air vibrating aound themselves.


My buddy nailed it when he said these guys who want to play loud, to
blow the roof off, are living a fantasy. They are imagining themselves
as the rock gods they see on tv and in concert. It never dawns on them
that the stage level at those big shows isn't jet airplane loud. It is
loud in the audience, but not to the performers themselves. If it
were, they'd all be deaf in months and totally unable to function. So
it isn't.

One comment on talkbass was that big loud bass amps will be around
until the last f..king shit hole bar closes.

So that's it. The key, the thing necessary for me to understand the
insanity of players wanting to blow my brains out on the stage. They
are doing what they think the big boys do. I thought they just
couldn't hear.

Ah, but the few of them that wear ear plugs AND still want to blow the
walls out should have been a clue. They really are just idiots. They
want the experience and sensations of being in the audience at a huge
rock concert .... while they are on the stage in a small club
performing.

They could do us all a favor, sell their instruments, and use that
money to buy some beer and go watch some modern " country " act in
concert :-)

talking to this with band girl, she pointed out that her started very
young. We were both out performing and doing tv and recording before we
fell into this mindset. I knew the stage levels weren't roaring loud
in tv studios on on cncert stages because I'd been on those performing
( as a sideman with someone older and more experienced guiding my way )
. And in my studio years, loud was absolutely a way to find yourself
out of work.

So that's it. I think I understand now.

Crazy loud stage levels really are one of the big differences between
pro's and wanna be's.


JimD

[Ouisie]

Post by Jim D
That's a phrase I've heard now and then over the last few years.
Confession ... I didn't get that they literally meant FEEL.

Low end bass and even infrasonic ranges can be easily felt.

Post by Jim D
A buddy of mine, bass player, told me he gets that phrase. Said when he
goes to a concert, he always wears ear plugs and wants to physically "
feel " the music, to have the music loud enough that it vibrates his body.

At bass and lower frequencies, that's easy.

Post by Jim D
There was a thread on talkbass.com ( or maybe it's .org ) this last week
about " are bass amps obsolete ? " I read 27 pages of the discussion. It
broke down to .... on the pro / concert / big club level, it's all IEM's
and direct into the FOH, basically a " silent stage ". On the low end,
it's amps, the bigger the better.

A 'silent stage'? No such thing!

Post by Jim D
The performers want to " feel " the air vibrating aound themselves.

Then they'll definitely want a rotary subwoofer ;)

Post by Jim D
My buddy nailed it when he said these guys who want to play loud, to blow
the roof off, are living a fantasy.

Yeah, that they could be so Stupid without Destroying their hearing, along
with those who get too close.

Post by Jim D
They are imagining themselves as the rock gods they see on tv and in
concert. It never dawns on them that the stage level at those big shows
isn't jet airplane loud. It is loud in the audience, but not to the
performers themselves. If it were, they'd all be deaf in months and
totally unable to function. So it isn't.

Nothing ever dawns on them - because they're DIMWITS !!!

Post by Jim D
One comment on talkbass was that big loud bass amps will be around until
the last f..king shit hole bar closes.

Bass amps are fine. Just like any other amp, they need to be operated
Intelligently!

Post by Jim D
So that's it. The key, the thing necessary for me to understand the
insanity of players wanting to blow my brains out on the stage. They are
doing what they think the big boys do. I thought they just couldn't hear.

They couldn't Think either!

Post by Jim D
Ah, but the few of them that wear ear plugs AND still want to blow the
walls out should have been a clue. They really are just idiots. They
want the experience and sensations of being in the audience at a huge rock
concert .... while they are on the stage in a small club performing.

But if they also wanted to experience the 'thrilling' sensations of playing
Russian Roulette, would they also point the guns at the audience? Because
that's quite similar to what they're doing with Dangerous sound pressure
levels!

Post by Jim D
They could do us all a favor, sell their instruments, and use that money
to buy some beer and go watch some modern " country " act in concert :-)

Just so long as they GO! Stupid people are better off Gone!!!

Post by Jim D
talking to this with band girl, she pointed out that her started very
young. We were both out performing and doing tv and recording before we
fell into this mindset. I knew the stage levels weren't roaring loud in
tv studios on on cncert stages because I'd been on those performing ( as a
sideman with someone older and more experienced guiding my way ) . And in
my studio years, loud was absolutely a way to find yourself out of work.
So that's it. I think I understand now.

What's to understand? that Only the UN-professionals are STUPID enough to
destroy their hearing?

Post by Jim D
Crazy loud stage levels really are one of the big differences between
pro's and wanna be's.

JimD

I've always known that - yet *another* reason for writing Original material
and playing *real* Professional venues!

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
That's a phrase I've heard now and then over the last few years.
Confession ... I didn't get that they literally meant FEEL.

Low end bass and even infrasonic ranges can be easily felt.

Agreed. But that's not what we are into. See my other post about
Boomers vs Zoomers.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
A buddy of mine, bass player, told me he gets that phrase. Said when he
goes to a concert, he always wears ear plugs and wants to physically "
feel " the music, to have the music loud enough that it vibrates his body.

At bass and lower frequencies, that's easy.

Post by Jim D
There was a thread on talkbass.com ( or maybe it's .org ) this last
week about " are bass amps obsolete ? " I read 27 pages of the
discussion. It broke down to .... on the pro / concert / big club
level, it's all IEM's and direct into the FOH, basically a " silent
stage ". On the low end, it's amps, the bigger the better.

A 'silent stage'? No such thing!

They are referring to no amps / floor wedges. Of course you could hear
people breathing and stuff :-)

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
The performers want to " feel " the air vibrating aound themselves.

Then they'll definitely want a rotary subwoofer ;)

Post by Jim D
My buddy nailed it when he said these guys who want to play loud, to
blow the roof off, are living a fantasy.

Yeah, that they could be so Stupid without Destroying their hearing,
along with those who get too close.

Stupid about nails it.

Same as smokers. Or heavy drinkers. Or dopers. They just don't care
about the long term consequences.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
They are imagining themselves as the rock gods they see on tv and in
concert. It never dawns on them that the stage level at those big
shows isn't jet airplane loud. It is loud in the audience, but not to
the performers themselves. If it were, they'd all be deaf in months
and totally unable to function. So it isn't.

Nothing ever dawns on them - because they're DIMWITS !!!

Post by Jim D
One comment on talkbass was that big loud bass amps will be around
until the last f..king shit hole bar closes.

Bass amps are fine. Just like any other amp, they need to be operated
Intelligently!

The talkbass thread was mostly pro's / full time players. They care
about their ears.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
So that's it. The key, the thing necessary for me to understand the
insanity of players wanting to blow my brains out on the stage. They
are doing what they think the big boys do. I thought they just
couldn't hear.

They couldn't Think either!

Post by Jim D
Ah, but the few of them that wear ear plugs AND still want to blow the
walls out should have been a clue. They really are just idiots. They
want the experience and sensations of being in the audience at a huge
rock concert .... while they are on the stage in a small club
performing.

But if they also wanted to experience the 'thrilling' sensations of
playing Russian Roulette, would they also point the guns at the
audience? Because that's quite similar to what they're doing with
Dangerous sound pressure levels!

stupid, ain't it.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
They could do us all a favor, sell their instruments, and use that
money to buy some beer and go watch some modern " country " act in
concert :-)

Just so long as they GO! Stupid people are better off Gone!!!

Post by Jim D
talking to this with band girl, she pointed out that her started very
young. We were both out performing and doing tv and recording before we
fell into this mindset. I knew the stage levels weren't roaring loud
in tv studios on on cncert stages because I'd been on those performing
( as a sideman with someone older and more experienced guiding my way )
. And in my studio years, loud was absolutely a way to find yourself
out of work.
So that's it. I think I understand now.

What's to understand? that Only the UN-professionals are STUPID enough
to destroy their hearing?

Post by Jim D
Crazy loud stage levels really are one of the big differences between
pro's and wanna be's.

JimD
I've always known that - yet *another* reason for writing Original
material and playing *real* Professional venues!
Ouisie

JimD

[Ouisie]

Post by Jim D
They are referring to no amps / floor wedges. Of course you could hear
people breathing and stuff :-)

It's got to sound strange when playing.

Post by Jim D
Stupid about nails it.
Same as smokers. Or heavy drinkers. Or dopers. They just don't care about
the long term consequences.

Smokers aren't so bad. At least they usually pay for their Stupidity by
themselves, but not with dangerous sound levels, which damage everyone's
hearing if they're within range.

Post by Jim D
The talkbass thread was mostly pro's / full time players. They care about
their ears.

Those are the only kinds I care to get involved with.

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
They are referring to no amps / floor wedges. Of course you could hear
people breathing and stuff :-)

It's got to sound strange when playing.

If you're using IEM's then what you hear is the IEM's. If you aren't
then this setup isn't doable.

I'm thinking of people in studios making recordings. Wearing
headphones has been the norm for decades. They seem to be able to
hear ok.

The big difference is in how much better it will sound to the audience.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
Stupid about nails it.
Same as smokers. Or heavy drinkers. Or dopers. They just don't care
about the long term consequences.

Smokers aren't so bad. At least they usually pay for their Stupidity by
themselves, but not with dangerous sound levels, which damage
everyone's hearing if they're within range.

These loud guys are driving themselves to extinction. Fine by me.
I'm thinking back now to one of my buddies bands, about 6 or so years
back, playing a " biker " bar. They were stupid loud. I could barely
stand being in the place. Weirdness was ... it seems everyone else was
just fine with that sound level. Well, everyone except the management.
They had reservations ... told the band that as long as the sound level
didn't exceed 115 at the bar in the adjoining room, it was ok.

What amazes me now is that the people there actually seems to want
things that loud. I was shocked by their sound check. The drummer was
just off the page loud, and in a relatively small room. What I know
NOW that I didn't know then, was that he wore earplugs. Not IEM's,
just regular sound deadening ear plugs. The reason was ... he didn't
want to ruin his OWN hearing.

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
The talkbass thread was mostly pro's / full time players. They care
about their ears.

Those are the only kinds I care to get involved with.
Ouisie

trying to bring mis-informed a amatures up to speed is often a lost
cause. On the talkbass thread about " are bass amps obsolete ", one of
the best responses was that some people hold on to big old amps out of
..... stubbornness and inertia. That about sums this whole thing up
about being far too loud on the stage.


Those two words describe our old loud drummers attitude exactly. He
always did things a certain way, and he wasn't about to change. Times
change. Practices / methods of working change. Some people don't.
Don't want to. Don't think they need to. Just won't. So then you
leave them and move on.

We did. Oh, and both of our old guys called this week wanting to know
if we had any work they could come along on. Both of them, loud
drummer and " other guy ".

Sadly, I couldn't offer them anything. Not because we're not working,
we're booked solid. We just don't need them and their problems. We
have new problems of our own now .... like .... what gigs to turn down
because we can't do them all. Seriously :-)


JimD

[Ouisie]

If you're using IEM's then what you hear is the IEM's. If you aren't then
this setup isn't doable.
I'm thinking of people in studios making recordings. Wearing headphones
has been the norm for decades. They seem to be able to hear ok.

I could probably tolerate headphones a lot longer than IEMs.

The big difference is in how much better it will sound to the audience.

But that won't help the musicians to hear it better, so they can perform
better, and that's the problem.

These loud guys are driving themselves to extinction.

Well, their hearing anyway, along with anyone close enough to be in the
Excessive sound pressure Danger zone.

Fine by me. I'm thinking back now to one of my buddies bands, about 6
or so years back, playing a " biker " bar. They were stupid loud. I could
barely stand being in the place. Weirdness was ... it seems everyone else
was just fine with that sound level.

Nothing weird about it - ever hear their Stupid Loud bikes?
That kind of lets you know what you're in for ;)

Well, everyone except the management.

Probably have mufflers on their bikes ;)

They had reservations ... told the band that as long as the sound level
didn't exceed 115 at the bar in the adjoining room, it was ok.

That's still too loud.

What amazes me now is that the people there actually seems to want things
that loud.

Because they're deaf.

I was shocked by their sound check. The drummer was just off the page
loud, and in a relatively small room.

Giving the Idiots the hearing aid effect at the expense of those who can
still hear.

What I know NOW that I didn't know then, was that he wore earplugs. Not
IEM's, just regular sound deadening ear plugs. The reason was ... he
didn't want to ruin his OWN hearing.

That's probably because he knows that if he wants to work, he's got to be
able to hear!

trying to bring mis-informed a amatures up to speed is often a lost cause.
On the talkbass thread about " are bass amps obsolete ", one of the best
responses was that some people hold on to big old amps out of .....
stubbornness and inertia. That about sums this whole thing up about
being far too loud on the stage.

When I use audio equipment, it's for a Valid, Intelligent reason, and I
just can't appreciate ANY other.

In other words, there's nothing wrong with bass amps, but there is
everything wrong with Idiots who don't know how to use them!

Those two words describe our old loud drummers attitude exactly. He
always did things a certain way, and he wasn't about to change.

I do lots of things certain ways but for specific reasons related to their
use, which means that I'm always adjusting things, for a reason, but that's
about being reasonable, not UNreasonable.

Times change. Practices / methods of working change. Some people don't.
Don't want to. Don't think they need to. Just won't. So then you leave
them and move on.

Hearing requirements never change.

We did. Oh, and both of our old guys called this week wanting to know if
we had any work they could come along on. Both of them, loud drummer and
" other guy ".
Sadly, I couldn't offer them anything. Not because we're not working,
we're booked solid. We just don't need them and their problems. We have
new problems of our own now .... like .... what gigs to turn down because
we can't do them all. Seriously :-)

JimD

Maybe you should tell them that and see if they can get a clue THEN! ;)

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
If you're using IEM's then what you hear is the IEM's. If you aren't
then this setup isn't doable.
I'm thinking of people in studios making recordings. Wearing
headphones has been the norm for decades. They seem to be able to
hear ok.

I could probably tolerate headphones a lot longer than IEMs.

Post by Jim D
The big difference is in how much better it will sound to the audience.

But that won't help the musicians to hear it better, so they can
perform better, and that's the problem.

Post by Jim D
These loud guys are driving themselves to extinction.

Well, their hearing anyway, along with anyone close enough to be in the
Excessive sound pressure Danger zone.

Post by Jim D
Fine by me. I'm thinking back now to one of my buddies bands, about
6 or so years back, playing a " biker " bar. They were stupid loud. I
could barely stand being in the place. Weirdness was ... it seems
everyone else was just fine with that sound level.

Nothing weird about it - ever hear their Stupid Loud bikes?
That kind of lets you know what you're in for ;)

Post by Jim D
Well, everyone except the management.

Probably have mufflers on their bikes ;)

Post by Jim D
They had reservations ... told the band that as long as the sound level
didn't exceed 115 at the bar in the adjoining room, it was ok.

That's still too loud.

Post by Jim D
What amazes me now is that the people there actually seems to want
things that loud.

Because they're deaf.

Post by Jim D
I was shocked by their sound check. The drummer was just off the page
loud, and in a relatively small room.

Giving the Idiots the hearing aid effect at the expense of those who
can still hear.

Post by Jim D
What I know NOW that I didn't know then, was that he wore earplugs.
Not IEM's, just regular sound deadening ear plugs. The reason was ...
he didn't want to ruin his OWN hearing.

That's probably because he knows that if he wants to work, he's got to
be able to hear!

Post by Jim D
trying to bring mis-informed a amatures up to speed is often a lost
cause. On the talkbass thread about " are bass amps obsolete ", one of
the best responses was that some people hold on to big old amps out of
..... stubbornness and inertia. That about sums this whole thing up
about being far too loud on the stage.

When I use audio equipment, it's for a Valid, Intelligent reason, and
I just can't appreciate ANY other.
In other words, there's nothing wrong with bass amps, but there is
everything wrong with Idiots who don't know how to use them!

Post by Jim D
Those two words describe our old loud drummers attitude exactly. He
always did things a certain way, and he wasn't about to change.

I do lots of things certain ways but for specific reasons related to
their use, which means that I'm always adjusting things, for a reason,
but that's about being reasonable, not UNreasonable.

Post by Jim D
Times change. Practices / methods of working change. Some people
don't. Don't want to. Don't think they need to. Just won't. So then
you leave them and move on.

Hearing requirements never change.

Post by Jim D
We did. Oh, and both of our old guys called this week wanting to know
if we had any work they could come along on. Both of them, loud
drummer and " other guy ".
Sadly, I couldn't offer them anything. Not because we're not working,
we're booked solid. We just don't need them and their problems. We
have new problems of our own now .... like .... what gigs to turn down
because we can't do them all. Seriously :-)

JimD
Maybe you should tell them that and see if they can get a clue THEN! ;)
Ouisie

They know how much we work. They are just too thick headed to
understand why we have so much work.

There are many reasons. We do songs people want to hear. We learn songs
people ask for. We don't drive all but the deafest out of the room by
playing stupid loud. We sound good. We have one of the best female
singers in the area .... lots of reasons.

Of course, if we were doing biker bars, we'd not succeed. Those places
want a different thing. They want LOUD. Loud drums, shreading guitars,
drunk chick out front screaming in the mic ...... I get that. I just
don't want to work there.

Oh, and last saturdays gig, we did that three piece. It went fine.
They payed us our normal $$$. I actually had talked to the management
beforehand, offered to do it for less, as we cut the band back in
personnel. They said, no, they had a budget, would pay the normal rate.
So same pay as for a four piece band, we split it in half. Band girl
got half, wife and I took the other half. Seems odd, but not really,
wife made that decision. We ( wife and I ) still came home with far
more than if we'd have taken the other two guys.

It feels weird talking about this and dancing around real numbers, so
I'll spill 'em. We do our small club gigs ( 3 hours typically ) in the
range of $300 to $400 dollars, for the trio. Band girl gets half, wife
( drums ) and I take the other half. No, that's not Vegas level
money, but since we play a lot, it does seem to add up :-) The trio
plays every weekend at least once, and I average 2 or 3 solo or duo
gigs thru the week. Basically, I'm playing every other day pretty much
out until sometime mid to late summer. Then a gap, then in the fall
the schedule starts up again.

Adding details like this might explain why we're cutting back on some
of the lower paying gigs. I want some time to rest and learn
matertial. Or even write some. Plus if one of us gets sick or hurt
that'd be a problem. No backup people to help us limp thru jobs. But
we're on a roll, so go with it.

a little more ... I don't make enough playing music to live on. That's
just not doable in the rural area where I live. I could earn a living
playing music, and I did for many years. One thing is, you have to be
in a big metro area. One with a lot of venues. I played 6 nights a week
for 15 years spread over several large cities. Could I do that now ?
Don't see why not. The only limit would be my physical ability to do
the work. I'm older, and so who know's. Doesn't matter.

The playing money is extra for us. Playing out gives me something to
do. A reason to get up every day. I want to be out there with people
having fun. That's the reason I do this. And it's why band girl does
also. Financially it's the same for her. She doesn't need to work.
Does is because it's better than sitting at home waiting to die.

That'll happen soon enough in any case.


JimD

[Ouisie]

They know how much we work. They are just too thick headed to understand
why we have so much work.

If they're really interested, they'll start Thinking about it, if not, then
it's no big deal to them in the first place.

There are many reasons. We do songs people want to hear. We learn songs
people ask for. We don't drive all but the deafest out of the room by
playing stupid loud. We sound good. We have one of the best female singers
in the area .... lots of reasons.

Then they can either get a clue, or remain clueless. In any case, it's their
choice.

Of course, if we were doing biker bars, we'd not succeed. Those places
want a different thing. They want LOUD. Loud drums, shreading guitars,
drunk chick out front screaming in the mic ...... I get that. I just
don't want to work there.

And loud motorcycles ;)

Oh, and last saturdays gig, we did that three piece. It went fine. They
payed us our normal $$$. I actually had talked to the management
beforehand, offered to do it for less, as we cut the band back in
personnel. They said, no, they had a budget, would pay the normal rate. So
same pay as for a four piece band, we split it in half. Band girl got
half, wife and I took the other half. Seems odd, but not really, wife
made that decision. We ( wife and I ) still came home with far more than
if we'd have taken the other two guys.

They must like your sound to do that.

It feels weird talking about this and dancing around real numbers, so I'll
spill 'em. We do our small club gigs ( 3 hours typically ) in the range
of $300 to $400 dollars, for the trio.

Maybe I need to think about moving to OH ;)

Band girl gets half, wife ( drums ) and I take the other half. No, that's
not Vegas level money, but since we play a lot, it does seem to add up
:-) The trio plays every weekend at least once, and I average 2 or 3 solo
or duo gigs thru the week. Basically, I'm playing every other day pretty
much out until sometime mid to late summer. Then a gap, then in the fall
the schedule starts up again.

Sounds like high class compared to what's around here in my neck of the
woods.

Adding details like this might explain why we're cutting back on some of
the lower paying gigs. I want some time to rest and learn matertial. Or
even write some. Plus if one of us gets sick or hurt that'd be a problem.
No backup people to help us limp thru jobs. But we're on a roll, so go
with it.

When you're on a roll, things are usually going relatively well and Vibes
are better, which means less stress and that means stronger immune systems
to keep you from getting sick ;)

a little more ... I don't make enough playing music to live on. That's
just not doable in the rural area where I live.

Your 'rural' area is a lot better then my being only several miles from
Chicago!

I could earn a living playing music, and I did for many years. One thing
is, you have to be in a big metro area. One with a lot of venues. I played
6 nights a week for 15 years spread over several large cities. Could I do
that now ? Don't see why not. The only limit would be my physical ability
to do the work. I'm older, and so who know's. Doesn't matter.

I want the *real* venues, where the pay can buy some roadies as I'm not too
interested in packing up, loading, unloading, setting up, and round and
round over and over ;)

The playing money is extra for us. Playing out gives me something to do.
A reason to get up every day. I want to be out there with people having
fun. That's the reason I do this. And it's why band girl does also.
Financially it's the same for her. She doesn't need to work. Does is
because it's better than sitting at home waiting to die.
That'll happen soon enough in any case.

JimD

That's the result of the Misery of winter. IF the weather ever gets any
better, I know I won't feel like I'm waiting to die...but I did write a song
about it, from the second album, Ignite The Sky:

1. Stranded

verse1
like a time of hibernation
except for being wide awake

better off to be unconscious
than suffer every pain and ache

a growing sense of aimless
and such a challenge to create

though everybody's 'blameless'
there's still rejection fear and hate

prechorus1
still I keep going
though not sure where

not really knowing
if someone else would care

chorus1
sometimes I feel like I've been stranded
marooned left behind to die

forgotten set aside unhanded
although I can't imagine why
or even try

verse2
broken off communication
longing for transmissions lost

constant worry and frustration
a fire freezing in the frost

of all the frozen isolation
of a whole lifetime to endure

in search of and appreciation
of real Love that's true and pure

prechorus2
still I won't leave
the path I chose

without reprieve
despite the blows

chorus2
sometimes I feel like I've been stranded
abandoned left out in the cold

denied and overlooked disbanded
deprived again for countless times untold
and it's gotten old

bridge
when I need the Love I've missed where can I find it
will it fall through the cracks like so many times before
'cause I'm still into life I've not resigned it
and I dare to hope for better things in store
worth living for

verse3
hanging on but hanging in there
praying so hard not to fall

to be delivered from this nightmare
backed all the way against the wall

still searching for a way around it
a chance to finally break out

unceasing effort 'til I've found it
to live what life should be about

prechorus3
and that is why
I have to try

and go for broke
it's do or die

chorus3
but sometimes I still feel like I've been stranded
though I try my best a better place to find
hoping someday soon that I'll have landed
and leave this hell on earth so far behind
for something less unkind
----------------------------------------------------

See what the Misery of winter can inspire!

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
They know how much we work. They are just too thick headed to
understand why we have so much work.

If they're really interested, they'll start Thinking about it, if not,
then it's no big deal to them in the first place.

Post by Jim D
There are many reasons. We do songs people want to hear. We learn songs
people ask for. We don't drive all but the deafest out of the room by
playing stupid loud. We sound good. We have one of the best female
singers in the area .... lots of reasons.

Then they can either get a clue, or remain clueless. In any case, it's
their choice.

Post by Jim D
Of course, if we were doing biker bars, we'd not succeed. Those places
want a different thing. They want LOUD. Loud drums, shreading guitars,
drunk chick out front screaming in the mic ...... I get that. I just
don't want to work there.

And loud motorcycles ;)

Post by Jim D
Oh, and last saturdays gig, we did that three piece. It went fine.
They payed us our normal $$$. I actually had talked to the management
beforehand, offered to do it for less, as we cut the band back in
personnel. They said, no, they had a budget, would pay the normal rate.
So same pay as for a four piece band, we split it in half. Band girl
got half, wife and I took the other half. Seems odd, but not really,
wife made that decision. We ( wife and I ) still came home with far
more than if we'd have taken the other two guys.

They must like your sound to do that.

Post by Jim D
It feels weird talking about this and dancing around real numbers, so
I'll spill 'em. We do our small club gigs ( 3 hours typically ) in the
range of $300 to $400 dollars, for the trio.

Maybe I need to think about moving to OH ;)

Post by Jim D
Band girl gets half, wife ( drums ) and I take the other half. No,
that's not Vegas level money, but since we play a lot, it does seem to
add up :-) The trio plays every weekend at least once, and I average 2
or 3 solo or duo gigs thru the week. Basically, I'm playing every other
day pretty much out until sometime mid to late summer. Then a gap,
then in the fall the schedule starts up again.

Sounds like high class compared to what's around here in my neck of the woods.

Post by Jim D
Adding details like this might explain why we're cutting back on some
of the lower paying gigs. I want some time to rest and learn
matertial. Or even write some. Plus if one of us gets sick or hurt
that'd be a problem. No backup people to help us limp thru jobs. But
we're on a roll, so go with it.

When you're on a roll, things are usually going relatively well and
Vibes are better, which means less stress and that means stronger
immune systems to keep you from getting sick ;)

Post by Jim D
a little more ... I don't make enough playing music to live on. That's
just not doable in the rural area where I live.

Your 'rural' area is a lot better then my being only several miles from
Chicago!

Post by Jim D
I could earn a living playing music, and I did for many years. One
thing is, you have to be in a big metro area. One with a lot of venues.
I played 6 nights a week for 15 years spread over several large cities.
Could I do that now ? Don't see why not. The only limit would be my
physical ability to do the work. I'm older, and so who know's. Doesn't
matter.

I want the *real* venues, where the pay can buy some roadies as I'm not
too interested in packing up, loading, unloading, setting up, and round
and round over and over ;)

Post by Jim D
The playing money is extra for us. Playing out gives me something to
do. A reason to get up every day. I want to be out there with people
having fun. That's the reason I do this. And it's why band girl does
also. Financially it's the same for her. She doesn't need to work. Does
is because it's better than sitting at home waiting to die.
That'll happen soon enough in any case.

JimD
That's the result of the Misery of winter. IF the weather ever gets any
better, I know I won't feel like I'm waiting to die...but I did write a
1. Stranded
verse1
like a time of hibernation
except for being wide awake
better off to be unconscious
than suffer every pain and ache
a growing sense of aimless
and such a challenge to create
though everybody's 'blameless'
there's still rejection fear and hate
prechorus1
still I keep going
though not sure where
not really knowing
if someone else would care
chorus1
sometimes I feel like I've been stranded
marooned left behind to die
forgotten set aside unhanded
although I can't imagine why
or even try
verse2
broken off communication
longing for transmissions lost
constant worry and frustration
a fire freezing in the frost
of all the frozen isolation
of a whole lifetime to endure
in search of and appreciation
of real Love that's true and pure
prechorus2
still I won't leave
the path I chose
without reprieve
despite the blows
chorus2
sometimes I feel like I've been stranded
abandoned left out in the cold
denied and overlooked disbanded
deprived again for countless times untold
and it's gotten old
bridge
when I need the Love I've missed where can I find it
will it fall through the cracks like so many times before
'cause I'm still into life I've not resigned it
and I dare to hope for better things in store
worth living for
verse3
hanging on but hanging in there
praying so hard not to fall
to be delivered from this nightmare
backed all the way against the wall
still searching for a way around it
a chance to finally break out
unceasing effort 'til I've found it
to live what life should be about
prechorus3
and that is why
I have to try
and go for broke
it's do or die
chorus3
but sometimes I still feel like I've been stranded
though I try my best a better place to find
hoping someday soon that I'll have landed
and leave this hell on earth so far behind
for something less unkind
----------------------------------------------------
See what the Misery of winter can inspire!
Ouisie

I like your lyrics. I save them, you know :-) Hope you don't mind.

My comment about needing to be in a bigger town is because there are
only a few places around here we want to work. The bigger the metro
area, the more people, the more places that we'd fit into.

Plus, the area you're in needs to have a good economy. Need enough
people with money to spend :-)

JimD

[Ouisie]

Post by Jim D
I like your lyrics.

Thanks.

Post by Jim D
I save them, you know :-) Hope you don't mind.

Of course I don't mind. I could send you the MP3 of it while I'm at
it...it's not very a happy song though ;)

Post by Jim D
My comment about needing to be in a bigger town is because there are only
a few places around here we want to work. The bigger the metro area, the
more people, the more places that we'd fit into.

A few decent venues beats a lot more crappy ones, like around here, any day!

Post by Jim D
Plus, the area you're in needs to have a good economy. Need enough people
with money to spend :-)

JimD

They don't seem to have any problem spending it on booze, but I don't want
to play places like that anymore.

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
I like your lyrics.

Thanks.

Post by Jim D
I save them, you know :-) Hope you don't mind.

Of course I don't mind. I could send you the MP3 of it while I'm at
it...it's not very a happy song though ;)

Post by Jim D
My comment about needing to be in a bigger town is because there are
only a few places around here we want to work. The bigger the metro
area, the more people, the more places that we'd fit into.

A few decent venues beats a lot more crappy ones, like around here, any day!

Post by Jim D
Plus, the area you're in needs to have a good economy. Need enough
people with money to spend :-)

JimD
They don't seem to have any problem spending it on booze, but I don't
want to play places like that anymore.
Ouisie

I get with you via email, cause sure, I'd like to hear your songs.

JimD

[Ouisie]

Post by Jim D
I get with you via email, cause sure, I'd like to hear your songs.

JimD

Okay. I'll send it now.

Ouisie

[Jim D]

Post by Ouisie

Post by Jim D
I get with you via email, cause sure, I'd like to hear your songs.

JimD
Okay. I'll send it now.
Ouisie

got it. haven't listened ... need a few spare minutes. I want to
listen thru my good setup.

JimD